New 2013 DC TRD 4x4 5.7L V8 ***FFV*** Nothing but problems. Bad gas mileage. Towing 4,500 lbs gets 8.1 mpg. Dealer has re-flashed the ECM. Did not last long. Non-FFV motors are getting much better mileage? My retirement plans have been destroyed. I'm trading it in. This FFV attempt by Toyota will cost me $6,000 ! ! !
rpriest500
***DO NOT BUY***Flex Fuel (FFV) 5.7L V8 Motor
There are members here with FFV without any issue. Did the dealer tell you what the problem is?
I had to explain it to the dealer. Via research on this page I identified it as "Alcohol Density Calculation". Toyota issued a Service Bulletin April 2013 (T-SB-0058-13). After they read it, they hooked my Tundra up to their computer. Here's their findings:
We followed up by performing the TSB you sent us. Here is the correction story from the technician. "RAN DIAGNOSTICS AND DATA SHOWED FUEL DENSITY AT 78% AND FUEL TRIMS IN NEGATIVE %'S. PERFORMED FUEL DENSITY RESET. CLEARED VALUES. ADDED 3 GALS, FUEL TEST DROVE FUEL DENSITY AT 0% WELL UNDER 15 % ALLOTMENT."
Alcohol sensor was reading 78% ethanol. I've never put E-85 in it. That "ECM Flash" lasted about a day and it went right back to the E-85 firing program. The dealer now says there's nothing more they can do. That is correct. It's an engineering failure. Not a dealer problem. I purchased it for a tow vehicle. 8.1 mpg pulling 4,500 lbs at 60 mph on flat ground ain't good. I cannot live with that. Must make a move.
We followed up by performing the TSB you sent us. Here is the correction story from the technician. "RAN DIAGNOSTICS AND DATA SHOWED FUEL DENSITY AT 78% AND FUEL TRIMS IN NEGATIVE %'S. PERFORMED FUEL DENSITY RESET. CLEARED VALUES. ADDED 3 GALS, FUEL TEST DROVE FUEL DENSITY AT 0% WELL UNDER 15 % ALLOTMENT."
Alcohol sensor was reading 78% ethanol. I've never put E-85 in it. That "ECM Flash" lasted about a day and it went right back to the E-85 firing program. The dealer now says there's nothing more they can do. That is correct. It's an engineering failure. Not a dealer problem. I purchased it for a tow vehicle. 8.1 mpg pulling 4,500 lbs at 60 mph on flat ground ain't good. I cannot live with that. Must make a move.
If what you are saying is the whole story, this doesn't make sense to me. The problem is that the adjustment didn't stick and they haven't even addressed this issue. I think you either have too look for a more capable dealership or go higher up in Toyota corporate ladder.
Anyone who can help with the fuel density problem would me muchly appreciated. It's a wonderful truck other than one small piece. I've had Toyota's since the early 80's.
I have a 2013 FFV and my gas milage is just as good as non FFV. I get 14-15 city and 16-17 on the highway. And what the hell do you expect towing a trailer that heavy. That's what I get and I expected that. Any one you talk to that tells you different that they get 14 mpg towing a 4500 pound trailer is full of sh!t. I think your truck is fine. But if your unhappy then spend the money and get a different gas engine and you will find out the same.
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Get your facts right before you butt in. Mine gets 13 mpg hwy at 65 mph. Read the thread on here (http://www.tundratalk.net/forums/tu...ervice-maintenance/119051-2012-cm-5-7-flex-4x4-rough-cold-starts-solved-46.html) and meet lots of us that have the same problem. Forty-Six pages of them.
My facts are fine. Their are also lots and lots of FFV tundra owners that have never had a single issue. Like me. So before you decide to make a huge thread to tell people to not buy FFV when there are many owners with no problems and good luck finding one without. So my argument is the same as yours expect there are not 100 pages of how people love there FFV tundras. Because typically no one will make a thread like that. And many have had the problem and have been able to get the problem fixed.
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I actually get 20 mpg in my flex tundra, can prove it as well. it has a lot to do with being regular cab short bed and cool air intake though.
I call bullshit on the 20mpg. I didn't the that prior s/c with a 2wd rcsb in the year I lived in Arizona. Never mind your flowblocker exhaust.
Lot of feathers flying in here... First of all I've got 18k miles on my flex fuel crewmax. I get about 14 with mostly in town driving and the times I've towed in town I reset the calculator just to see and it was going between 6-11 on the instant
. I really feel bad for you guys having problems with this because I went thru a similar experience with my Tacoma I had. If you have a problem, make sure you take it in often and as soon as possible, like it looks like you have, and get the documentation of trying to get it fixed in hand. Don't leave it to toyota to store everything on the owners portion of the website. Call the 800 number and let them know what's happening and they will open a case. After that they will probably want you to take it back in. At this point you should have already researched your states lemon law. I know, you say lemon law ind it's scoffed at, but you better know or you let yourself be screwed. After they have made the required amount of attempts to fix it with out success, most states require a written request to the the main office giving them a certain period to fix the vehicle. My state is 30 days. Just be nice but explain your trucks problem and send copies of the documented service attempts. If you follow those state guidelines, toyota would probably use your states calculations for lemon law and buy it back. This is what happened with my Tacoma. It works and toyota will work with you. I just went way further with it than you may need, but hey it's just advice. It doesn't seem like the other ffv guys that have this problem have got it resolved, but maybe they have. My main point is to document and try for repair before you go losing money.
All that being said you might find out what others are getting while towing that amount. Thousands of these ffv trucks are sold with no problems at all. Good luck.
. I really feel bad for you guys having problems with this because I went thru a similar experience with my Tacoma I had. If you have a problem, make sure you take it in often and as soon as possible, like it looks like you have, and get the documentation of trying to get it fixed in hand. Don't leave it to toyota to store everything on the owners portion of the website. Call the 800 number and let them know what's happening and they will open a case. After that they will probably want you to take it back in. At this point you should have already researched your states lemon law. I know, you say lemon law ind it's scoffed at, but you better know or you let yourself be screwed. After they have made the required amount of attempts to fix it with out success, most states require a written request to the the main office giving them a certain period to fix the vehicle. My state is 30 days. Just be nice but explain your trucks problem and send copies of the documented service attempts. If you follow those state guidelines, toyota would probably use your states calculations for lemon law and buy it back. This is what happened with my Tacoma. It works and toyota will work with you. I just went way further with it than you may need, but hey it's just advice. It doesn't seem like the other ffv guys that have this problem have got it resolved, but maybe they have. My main point is to document and try for repair before you go losing money.
All that being said you might find out what others are getting while towing that amount. Thousands of these ffv trucks are sold with no problems at all. Good luck.
Take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt since most trucks with problems are 2012-2013 from what I've seen. But I have had experiences with 3 FFV Tundras personally. 2010 Double cab short box 4x4 (totaled @ 55,000 miles), my current 2011 Double cab short box 4x4 (27,700 miles on the clock), and currently a 2014 Double cab short box 4x4 (3,200 miles on the clock) and none of my trucks have had issues.
When all 3 of these trucks were stock, I got 18-21 MPGs doing pure highway trips. Now that both my 2011 and the 2014 both sit on 35s with lift kits they get roughly ~15 MPGs now if I'm lucky. When towing is about 7-10 MPGs, so it's not amazing.
I will say, my dealership said they were aware of the issue when we purchased the 2014 FFV. But they also said the reflash had solved all the issues and hadn't had anymore complaints from those owners that got the reflash.
I live in Missouri and I fill up my 5.7 FFV Tundra with either regular 87 or 91 octane gas, and like I said I haven't had a single issue that a lot of people complain about.
I do feel sorry for those experiencing the issue, and I know there is a problem. But I think labeling all the FFVs as complete junk is ludicrous.
When all 3 of these trucks were stock, I got 18-21 MPGs doing pure highway trips. Now that both my 2011 and the 2014 both sit on 35s with lift kits they get roughly ~15 MPGs now if I'm lucky. When towing is about 7-10 MPGs, so it's not amazing.
I will say, my dealership said they were aware of the issue when we purchased the 2014 FFV. But they also said the reflash had solved all the issues and hadn't had anymore complaints from those owners that got the reflash.
I live in Missouri and I fill up my 5.7 FFV Tundra with either regular 87 or 91 octane gas, and like I said I haven't had a single issue that a lot of people complain about.
I do feel sorry for those experiencing the issue, and I know there is a problem. But I think labeling all the FFVs as complete junk is ludicrous.
If the trucks ECU is constantly thinking you're running E85 then it makes perfect sense why you are getting bad mileage. If Toyota can't fix it, get it lemoned. Wish you the best of luck on this issue.
Don't listen to those telling you that you are crazy or your truck is insignificant. Most fanboys on this site will swear up and down that a Toyota can't have problems, but no matter what the brand lemons exist. Even if this problem exist on a small percentage, that can still equate to hundreds or thousands of trucks depending what the percentage is. If I were buying a 5.7L, I would fly to a state to buy a non FFV because I am aware that there is a greater fail rate of FFV vs non-FFV's. People need to be aware of that.
Don't listen to those telling you that you are crazy or your truck is insignificant. Most fanboys on this site will swear up and down that a Toyota can't have problems, but no matter what the brand lemons exist. Even if this problem exist on a small percentage, that can still equate to hundreds or thousands of trucks depending what the percentage is. If I were buying a 5.7L, I would fly to a state to buy a non FFV because I am aware that there is a greater fail rate of FFV vs non-FFV's. People need to be aware of that.
I'm getting 14 mpg in the city with my FFV model. Out here I didn't have a choice, it's about all they sell out here. The only thing about the engine is the 5000 mile interval instead of the 10000 mile oil change interval. Just take a deep breath and work with your dealer. If they can't help, upchannel your request to Toyota.
I had another fellow tech mention about ffv having bad mileage. Never had a complaint with my 2011 and current 2014, I get 11-12mpg but that's my driving habit.
As an FFV owner WITH problems, wish I had read a post like this before purchasing. I cannot let it go without advising others. This is getting their attention.
look at his average mpg on his dash, now do you believe me??? haha i def get the same and i have a level and 32" tires, sorry for you guys that are getting crappy mpgs
I have a 13 Crewmax 4x4 ffv with 20in wheels and BFG rugged Terrains towing package with 4.33s. I drive probably a grand total of 6.5 miles to work with multiple stops and turns. average about 12mps and honestly im not exactly easy on it. i did how ever pick an empty car dolly, drove approx. 40 miles. Loaded up a Pontiac Grand am towed it aprox 40 miles and got 14ish on that tank. for granite half that was with the trailer empty so it weighed next to nothing. and with the car and dolly it was not over 4000. its a truck they typically don't get decent milage unless its a desiel. but then your spending more on diesel a gallon
find another dealer who gives a crap there are tons out there most not good but some do care.
what is your avg mpg on hwy. not towing anything? Should be around 16 avg mpg hwy. up to usually 17 avg mpg hwy (give or take 1-2 depending on road conditions).
If towing 4K lbs. with NON E85 gas just E10, then what do you expect? I would expect around 12-13 avg mpg at best but more like 10-11 mpg. I ONLY get 15 avg mpg hwy. pulling my 17' fishing boat or small 2 ATV trailer each weighing around 2,000 lbs. total. I can see 10-12 avg mpg pulling 4-5K lbs.
It's under warranty and if dealers cannot fix, file lemon law and let corp. toyota cover your expenses you shouldn't be out a dime and not having to trade it in if it should be fixed under 3/36K miles.
what is your avg mpg on hwy. not towing anything? Should be around 16 avg mpg hwy. up to usually 17 avg mpg hwy (give or take 1-2 depending on road conditions).
If towing 4K lbs. with NON E85 gas just E10, then what do you expect? I would expect around 12-13 avg mpg at best but more like 10-11 mpg. I ONLY get 15 avg mpg hwy. pulling my 17' fishing boat or small 2 ATV trailer each weighing around 2,000 lbs. total. I can see 10-12 avg mpg pulling 4-5K lbs.
It's under warranty and if dealers cannot fix, file lemon law and let corp. toyota cover your expenses you shouldn't be out a dime and not having to trade it in if it should be fixed under 3/36K miles.
My drive back from OK to LA when I picked up my 2010 Crewmax 4wd FFV my dash said I was averaging 18.2 mpg. My weekly driving to and from work I am averaging 15-16 mpg. When I pull my Malibu Wakesetter boat I get around 10-12 mpg depending on which lake I go to, one is in more of a hilly area. I was expecting this and I am happy with it. If I wanted better fuel mileage I would have gotten a Tacoma or better yet a Camry, but neither of those would pull my boat as good.
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