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Discussion Starter • #1 a moment ago
Hi Tundra Folks.

New to forum - but not to wrenches. I am your average backyard mechanic who chooses to wrench a lot.
I am a motorcycle wrench & builder who has Toyota'd for decades because I want to work on bikes... not my Toyotas.

2013 Tundra Limited (5.7L). 120,000 kms. Has had nothing other than tires/brakes/oil through its life. Has suddenly started stalling and falling flat on its face. Very typical no fuel feel. Coughs out and dies. Push it to the floor and continues to cough and skip and stall out. Pull over... restart and its good for another few Kilometres. Even went for a good hard 10 Kilometre rip and flogged it and it was fine. 5000 RPM and pulling fine. Then shut it off. Start it up and it will idle out to stall in 30 seconds or may idle for 2 minutes and then start to drop out.

No check engine light. Simple scanner shows P1603 (Engine Stall History) and P1605 (Knock Control CPU)...

No vacuum leaks apparent. I verified fuel pressure regulator on rail (relieves ~ 50 psi air). I assumed a failing fuel pump or plugging filter (truck has sat a lot over past 2 months) and dropped the tank and installed a new pump assembly ($800 Canadian)... Nothing changed.

Engine starts fine. After 30 seconds - 2 minutes it begins to stumble and drop to 500-600 RPM and missing. Eventually will stall flat within a few minutes. If I stab the pedal, the RPM will drop to 200-300 RPM and just cough out. Then it will restart straight away. Idle never feels perfectly clean like it always has... it fells like it misses on a cylinder ever few seconds.

I have inspected the MAF sensor and cleaned the throttle body (it was squeaky clean). Newish air filter. Fuel pressure appears plentiful when removing line after engine off and it sprays 6-8 feet (do not have pressure fuel pressure tester).

I am wondering if there are any folks who could point me to any known issues ?

Thanks in advance.

HERE IS A LINK TO A VIDEO OF WHAT IS OCCURRING:


HERE IS LINK TO SCREEN RECORD OF LIVE DATA WHEN STALLING (cheap reader not able to see deeper Toyota specific outputs):

 

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I had a similar problem but mine wouldn't start at all after awhile... this was what I found out. I posted this awhile back


So here is the update... I couldn't figure it out myself so I had to get it towed to the shop. It was the ECM!

"The electric fuel pump draws high current, so it is not controlled directly by the ECM. Instead, the ECM controls a fuel pump relay which in turn controls system voltage to the fuel pump circuit. ... The ECM grounds the relay circuit as long as it receives ignition reference pulses.

Hopefully this helps anyone who runs into this problem. It's an easy replacement if you can diagnose it yourself.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Wasabi2012 - Thank you for reply!

I am wondering what year your truck is? I have found youtube videos troubleshooting the system on gen 3 Tundras (2014 and newer) that show a pump speed control by a stepped ground which is similar to what you mention. In my pump I have a return to the tank and do not believe that the pump speed is controlled by the ECM/ECU but I cannot confirm this... it is just a hunch but I would love to be corrected.

Did you replace the fuel pump relay- I cannot understand from your message what the "fix" was ?

The Haynes manual does not show a wiring diagram for this year...

Thank you!
 

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Thanks Wasabi - I think I may be more confused from that personal resume writeup...

My truck runs - it starts fine... every time... has a fuel pump feeding the fuel rail. It runs and drives and then eventually idles rough and smothers out. The fuel pump must be providing fuel to the injectors or it could not start and idle for minutes. The videos show this. The pump runs. And yes, I hear it running when the ignition is turned to on unlike the article states.

I cannot see any of the diagrams to follow along all of the personal tales...

so apparently theres a Fuel Pump Control ECU ... sound that out without the acronyms ... Fuel Pump Control Engine Control Unit... Not redundant one bit.

Kinda hoped that the part of controlling the engine implied by an "Engine Control Unit" would encompass controlling the most fundamental item required for control in said engine... fuel.

Replacing an Engine Control Module ... that should never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever need replacing unless the car is hit by lightening... is considered an easy fix?

Wasabi- Did you replace the ECU that is on the firewall and should control the engine (thousands of $) ? Or this box of mystery shunted grounds that is referred to as Fuel Pump Control ECU that resides near the rear wheel ?

Thanks very much for your help.

I'll be searching for a carburetor or and welcoming EVs... since the over electrification happened long ago...
 

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Maybe a gas tank vent filter is clogged so the tank it pulling a vacuum? I would install a fuel pressure gauge and make sure the fuel pressure is not dropping. Also, spark plugs should be changed around 100-110K. Maybe those are wore out? I would also take a close look at the air intake system to make sure some mouse did not build a house in the air intake tube area ahead of the filter blocking the air. Not sure what else to go after. Let us know what you find.
 

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Yes... I replaced the mystery box by the rear tire. All the research I did after the fact said that you can bypass it to see if that is your problem. I couldn't figure it out so took it to the mechanic and it took him longer to diagnose then to fix.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thank you for reply Wasabi - my crazy crazy crazy issues continue... I may start a new thread asking for more help?

To be clear, to get an appointment at the only dealership within 100 miles is 2 weeks wait just to get a Techstream scan. (More on that later)

My truck starts fine... it is fine to start. Every time. Fires right up.
I was able to limp the the truck with 20+ stalls to travel 2 miles at a snails pace of spitting and stumbling to a local garage for an enhanced scan that shows nothing. $200 Worth of inspection to show nothing. He said he did a fuel pressure check and "got in the 30 psi range".
The mechanic said it just feels like it is starving for fuel and stalling out after a minute or 2... He suggested that I install another fuel pump... remember last week I installed a brand new fuel pump... maybe I didn't have enough fuel in the tank or the new pump was faulty...

I installed a new pump for the 2nd time.

No difference... it is still running and starting fine and then just stalling dead. No codes. Dies after about a minute of running fine..

HELP PLEASE: I WILL PAY WHO POINTS ME IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

VIDEOS of today:






New fuel pump
Fuel lines all blown out several times
Tank cleaned
Verified pressure regulator on the rail is relieving pressure ~ 50psi and that the rail is getting full pressure and fuel is returning to tank.

With my BlueDriver I can verify that the Bank1&2 A/F sensors are running as they should ~ 3V... They are reacting as they should - even if they weren't I would not thing failed sensor could stall the truck from 1000 rpm idle. They are working fine.

WHAT CAN CAUSE A TRUCK TO JUST SHUT OFF??

Thanks in advance for any help.
 
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