Any thoughts? The German Castrol (now called Castrol Edge SPT) 0w30 seems to be what's recommended for our 5.7 (I could be wrong, the 0w30 may just be the only grade readily available in this region, etc.) The Amsoil Signature Series 5w20 was my top contender but this German Made Castrol seems to be pretty damn good too. The GC comes in at about 8$ a gallon cheaper online-not a big diff in my opinion. I wanna run the better oil regardless. I need someone in the know to compare the numbers.
That makes sense, so why would Toyota call for 0w20 or 5w20? They must have a reason. Of course, all this is relational. Top shelf group IV oils are thinner when they need to be and thicker when they need to be.
So they called for 20w instead of 30 since its thinner for MPG? If so, screw that. The GC is reported to be very "thin" for a 30w while retaining a good "thick" viscosity at high temps. I'm sure the same is true with Amsoil SS. I would've thought Mobil 1 would be in the top choices-it is a great lubricant-but when it comes to 'top shelf premium' (i.e. Group IV PAO), Mobil 1 seems to fall short. I have had great luck over the years with Mobil 1 but I think i'm gonna step up. For 15 bucks per year, it's worth it. I can't wait to see the Analysis results from some of the board users here.
The whole lineup went to 20w in 2007 due to the new mileage requirements. These engines run much quieter with 30w. Even the wifes lexus runs much better on it. Only thing I run 20w in is my kia 4 cyl.
keep in mind, staying with a 0W winter rating is best for cold starts...even in warm weather, cold/initial starts are where your engine gets a lot of its wear and tear. a 0W offers more wear protection vs. a 5W for the cold starts. on the hot side / operating temperature, 30 is thicker than 20, so you get less noise in these engines. and in extreme hot areas, 30 is definitely the way to go.
I asked my dealer about this also, since this was the first vehicle I have owned that asked for 20W oil, I think my wifes Huyndai does also now that I think about it.
I was told that 30W would starve the engine for oil, this from a dealer.
Now I am starting to re-think using 20W on next oil change, due to the Texas heat.
That would be a good indication to never visit that dealer again. You'll never go back to 20w once you run 30w, the truck runs so much smoother and quieter. These engines never should have been touted to use 20w from the beginning. Catering to govt fuel regs was the the only reason to use it.
that's funny! It could not starve the engine of oil...it just gives you a very slightly thicker oil at normal and high temps...otherwise, the manual wouldn't say it is safe...I'd show the dealer the book and ask why Toyota would print that it's acceptable...especially if the engine will starve! Ask him for his documentation that goes against Toyota's!
I agree that 0w30 won't be too thick for our 5.7's, but if I'm not mistaken, the owner's manual does NOT recommend using 0w30. But I bet it's for MPG, not because it's too thick for proper lubrication.
Just glancing over the spec's of both oils, the AZO AMSOIL is better but edge provides little info to compare. Probably so no one can compare.
AZO had better cold cranking spec's (more fuel efficient). Matter of fact the level to meet the 0W is 6200 and edge came in right at 6200 with AZO at 5954, 6200 and below is rated 0W. 6201 would make it a 5W-30.
AZO had higher viscosity index (less susceptible to changes in viscosity).
AZO has a volatility of only 7.8% but edge does not list that spec. Volatility is the % of oil that is burned off from the heat of the engine. Petroleum oils are typically near the 15% API max spec, any oil over 15% fails to meet api specs. To lower the number requires more expense in additives and drives the price up.
Not sure how much you know about oil - so please don't be offended - just adding to your post to help...because it is very tough to say which oil is better without knowing much more than what you've posted.
Cold Cranking Simulator (CCS) is just one test method that is, per ASTM D5293, not suitable for predicting low temperature flow to the engine oil pump and oil distribution system. CCS is simply the test method for apparent viscosity of engine oils and base stocks between -5 and -35 C. This test is not one of my concerns when choosing an oil - because it depends on too many factors that the oil manufacturers control.
Viscosity Index, by definition, is an arbitrary measure. Arbitrary, by definition, is based on random choice or personal whim - meaning it is very subjective and can be biased. I ignore this index all together - it's like McDonald's saying their fryer oil is better than Burger King's.
Volatility - ASTM D6417 - 09, is one method of testing - but is an alternative to D 5800 and Noack method. Calculated results of oil volatility estimation by this test method can be biased by the presence of additives (polymeric materials) or by heavier base oils not completely eluting from the column. The results may not correlate with other volatility methods for non hydrocarbon synthetic oils. ASTM 5800, another method, is testing for oil evaporation at high temps. AKA, oil consumption...and further more, changes in properties of oils. Who uses which method, and why?
I only point these things out because I am data driven...I don't choose one oil over the next by measurements and standards that oil companies can manipulate or exploit. You can blend any engine oil to test well on certain specs. Also, as shown in the examples above, there are different test methods sanctioned by various oil authorities. It is up to the oil manufacturers to decide which is best for them, their quality goals & certification requirements, and how they go to market.
Unless we know the exact test methods used, and have the testing done by a neutral third party, we can never know the truth about any brand. Except, by conducting analysis at our third party labs...then we can compare without bias! See the UOAs we are now posting on Bad Dad's Tundra's thread!
If was home, I would join you with the shots. But what fosterelli said did BARELY make sense. I'm sure there was much sense, I only made some of it. But I agree that corporations as a whole (ESPECIALLY oil companies) can doctor info any way they want. And I also agree that independent 3rd part testing-using the SAME testing criteria and methods is the only way to go. What I love the most is how interesting all this is to me, and to you guys too, when most people would be massively bored by this.
I had 1st service on my 2014 5.7 at the dealer, like an idiot i know, but was due to recall etc, so got it done, I asked if the oil I had was synthetic 0w-20, he replied yes, and that its genuine Toyota Oil and to maintain warranty best to use that as well as stick to their service intervals yada yada yada
I asked as my mechanic who wanted to know so next service he will do, i asked who made Toyota Oil, no response given, i emailed Toyota Canada the same question, no response
Question, does anyone know who makes this, as the dealer price of buying was i think 10 bucks a liter, or something crazy
Costco sells a Castrol Edge synthetic at the warehouse which goes on sale very now and then, so that's why I am looking for help
I had 1st service on my 2014 5.7 at the dealer, like an idiot i know, but was due to recall etc, so got it done, I asked if the oil I had was synthetic 0w-20, he replied yes, and that its genuine Toyota Oil and to maintain warranty best to use that as well as stick to their service intervals yada yada yada
I asked as my mechanic who wanted to know so next service he will do, i asked who made Toyota Oil, no response given, i emailed Toyota Canada the same question, no response
Question, does anyone know who makes this, as the dealer price of buying was i think 10 bucks a liter, or something crazy
Costco sells a Castrol Edge synthetic at the warehouse which goes on sale very now and then, so that's why I am looking for help
And I hate BP. Castrol's entire line-up may be mad by BP. I reluctantly used German Castrol, but now that it's not even made in Germany, I will probably switch to Amsoil until I hear that the Belgian Castrol is the same as German Castor via UOA's.
Toyota Motor Oil in the bottle is made by Mobil1, as for what the dealer uses for bulk oil depends on the dealership, usually dealers will use only bottled oil for new cars that are still under warranty.
Most Toyota Canada Dealers don't have synthetic oil in bulk they'll use bottles instead.
In CA, I wouldn't hesitate to run 5W. During Michigan winters, I want that oil as thin as possible while maintaining adequate lubrication. OW-20 or OW-30 is a better bet up north if you run at or below freezing much. Our 5.7's sound rough enough on cold starts. I've heard people say we sound like we have diesels for the first minute or 2. I doubt it's that bad, but I'll take any help I can get from the low temp viscosity rating on my oil.
0w40 is Belgium (I SAW IT IN WALLY-MART last week) and 0w30 is German. But then what do I know I have 4 years German supply for my crossover that takes 30. Usually see it at AUTO ZONE OR ADVANCED AUTO, the 0w30 GC that is.
Double check that 0w30 label. If it's the old label, it's still made in Germany. The Castrol Full synthetic 0w30 (euro formula) that I bought 2 weeks ago was made in Belgium, as was the 0w40. They actually had some of the old German castrol on the shelf also, mixed right in with the newer 0w30 made in Belgium. The new 0w30 doesnt say SPT, etc. It might just say Syntec. I could be wrong, but I doubt they are making 2 different oils, both marked full synthetic, both 0w30 and both euro formula. I think all the new good stuff comes out of waffle town. But please correct me if I'm wrong. That's why I posted it here. I'm guessing the stuff you saw at wally-world was just previous stock. The switch seemed to happen very recently.
wally world needs to start carrying the 5 quart jugs of the 0w30. They only have 40.
Tundra gets MO1 0W20. Dealer does changes and don't want to hear BS from them about 30 weight so like "if your engine fails it was the oil" or something stupid like that.
I thought the the 1st number in the viscosity designation was in regards to start-up oil consistency (i.e. 0w20 would be thinner at start-up than 5w20.) But you're saying that the second number is relevant also at start up ("cold".) In other words, 5w20 is thinner at start-up than 5w30? I realize the difference is minute, but I do try and understand this stuff the best I can.
Regarding Toyota Genuine Motor Oil, yes, it's made by Mobil. But, it's blended to Toyota's specifications. I was researching this on Bob Is The Oil Guy website, and a few virgin oil analysis results showed TGMO had the best cold weather flow characteristics. Also, Used Oil Analysis reports showed TGMO performs very well compared to other synthetics.
The obsessive/compulsive part of me keeps splitting hairs when it comes to maintaining my automobiles. In reality, ANY reputable synthetic motor oil will keep engines running just fine with proper change intervals. It's funny how brand loyal we are.
This makes total sense. But the OCD in me wonders how TGMO compares to the top tier motor oils that we hold true as if it were Gospel. What do the UOA's say regarding TGMO vs. German (Belgian) castrol, Amsoil Sig Series, and other Group 4 PAO. But regardless, I do agree that any good synthetic at regular intervals is going to keep a Toyota engine running well for a very, very long time.
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